THE BREAKFAST CLUB

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[00:00:20] Phil: You have an opportunity to be the fifth host of our little show. Click the link in the show notes and leave us a voice message telling us what movie you would like us to review. You can [00:00:30] also reach out on our Facebook page, Fellowship of the Real. From all of us at Fellowship of the Real, thanks for listening.

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[00:00:42] Phil: Are you recording

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[00:00:45] Phil: Studying a movie in the mechanical level, I think can, can really bring some revelation.

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[00:00:56] James: on paper,

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[00:01:01] Sherry: That's your own fault. If you haven't seen

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[00:01:08] Phil: Even the actors don't know what that movie is about. Shit, I, I wish I wrote that. Which I love the title, but that movie's trash. Well, it's oatmeal, man. It's good for you. Okay. Here we are at Fellowship of the Real talking movies. Uh, this episode is a redo. I'll just put that out there. The [00:01:30] audience can thank me for never hearing the first attempt at this.

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[00:01:55] Phil: And Sherry had talked to her lawyer about a divorce. So. We, [00:02:00] we just stopped and, uh, I said, we're going to just redo this. And I went back and I cut down my notes to what I thought was essential and the beats. And so we're going to try to keep this to an hour. The, the first attempt we were at an hour and I, nice.

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[00:02:38] Phil: We are Not in the studio. And so we were subject to the, Oh, you

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[00:02:49] James: Yeah. Mark Maron has, uh, a guy next door that does yard work and he'll be in there interviewing Sam Elliott, Barack Obama.

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[00:02:59] Phil: hear, [00:03:00] no, I like what the fuck, what WTF. I love that podcast. I listened to it.

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[00:03:08] Phil: fuck are you looking at? Fuck's sake. I mean,

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[00:03:14] Phil: No, no.

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[00:03:17] Chris: Yes. I agree with him. I don't want to go down that

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[00:03:26] James: redo. Hey, maybe that was a podcast caller. Yeah. Sure.

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[00:03:30] Phil: It probably was.

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[00:03:33] Phil: Not his pipe. Well, they, well, it's a, it's a big pipe, so it'll be on the website page. We are not. Anyway, yeah, I just, I

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[00:03:50] Phil: we'll never see the light of day, but I deleted it.

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[00:03:59] Chris: yourself, but I guess [00:04:00] when we talked about. At one point and again, we're still new at this. We're trying to figure out what we want to do and how we want to do it.

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[00:04:22] Chris: Like, I guess that's where my, my head went on that. On the redo, especially if you could lift some of that and put it into the one we're going to do [00:04:30] today, or add to it, or I don't know, and granted, you're the tech guy doing all that stuff,

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[00:04:56] James: I've never seen someone so cracked out after a chili dog, [00:05:00] you were energized.

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[00:05:19] James: say though, after, after that incident of you, just, you were so thoughtful about what you were doing and putting it together.

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[00:05:38] Phil: No, he, uh, for sure. Yes. No, he is. They're obvious. And I didn't get into like the archetypal characters. Okay. But, but writers will make use of archetypal characters.

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[00:06:06] Chris: as far as to take it back to Blake Snyder terms, he's everybody's B story, right?

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[00:06:16] James: would say, I don't know how much Bender changes throughout the movie. He seems.

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[00:06:34] Chris: So that's why I thought maybe there was change there, you know, but maybe he. Yes, uh, and he's attracted to grow from, you know, the opening scene to the end. So maybe he's a dude. So maybe always, you know, wouldn't if he had the chance, but,

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[00:07:00] Phil: Right. And so I think. He's using that as a vehicle to shake things up, but I think there's probably something there. You know, whatever. Anyway. Well, you want to do box office and all that stuff? Yeah, well, there's a couple things I wanted to Oh, okay. mention. We need, we need obviously people to listen and people are listening but it's It's the, the, the downside of a movie review podcast, I think is people will listen to the episodes they want based on the movies they like rather than every single episode.

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[00:07:47] Phil: We want to talk about and that's completely nerdish. Like if we were a comic book podcast, we'd be talking about, you know, origin stories and Superman and all, you know, we would delve that deep into the nerdom of. Comic books or whatever, but we're doing [00:08:00] that with story. And so I don't know that that is necessarily going to appeal to the casual listener or the casual movie fan, but I hope that there's like a bunch of story nerds out there who will find us and maybe even writers or whatever who want to just comb through things.

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[00:08:17] Chris: about, right? Like that's what I feel like it's gonna be, you know, a work in progress finding kind of the fine line because you know Going like you said going that nerdy and breaking down the mechanics of story That's what sets us I feel like sets us apart from the [00:08:30] rest of the podcast out there in the movie podcast But at the same time, yeah, we want everybody to you know to enjoy each episode and all that stuff and even I mean You hit the nail on the head in my own experience checking out other movie podcasts.

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[00:08:47] Phil: And if, if we have, once we get enough episodes, if we decide we want to continue doing this, there will be a snowball effect where people have more options to check out. And so we're getting more daily listeners, even if it's not [00:09:00] every episode or whatever.

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[00:09:22] Phil: And so there is a listener in Bengaluru, I'm going to not get this right. Bengaluru, [00:09:30] uh, Karnataka in the country of India somewhere who has listened to our podcast. So if you're listening now, they listen to Blind Date. And so hopefully they'll come back. Hi. Yeah. Hello there. Hi Bengaluru, Karma, Taka, India.

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[00:09:47] Chris: you for,

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[00:10:06] Phil: You can leave us a voicemail. Uh, comments, tell us what you want us to review, what you thought of the movie we reviewed, and also Facebook. com, Fellowship of the Real, you can also comment and post and we try to put stuff up there that's movie related or whatever. Alright, how it came out, Money Critics fans, I guess we're doing the Breakfast Club first.

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[00:10:49] Phil: And, and, uh, it had a budget of a million dollars and domestically it made 45 million. Internationally, 5, 600, 000 for [00:11:00] A total of 51, 525, 51 million on a budget of 1 million. So they had to be happy about that. Uh, this movie is universally loved. Tomato meter, uh, over its history. Critics, uh, that have given it three stars and above is 89%.

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[00:11:32] James: this was John John Hughes? John Hughes. I was gonna say, yeah. Uh, this second movie, After 16 Candles.

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[00:11:43] Phil: really took off. And before Vacation as well, right? Yeah. Well, he He wrote Vacation. He didn't

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[00:11:50] Phil: National Yeah, I think he had a script out there. Yeah, because he wrote Yeah, he wrote it in the

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[00:12:01] Phil: He wrote those. Uh, his writing record held up to almost any other writer in Hollywood. I don't know, I don't know that many writers and their, their, uh, resumes. But Hughes has got to have more movies than I, I couldn't think of another writer. Maybe you can, Chris, that has that many movies that Uh, you know, scored a hit that, that, you know, are made.

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[00:12:31] Chris: Yeah. No, cause he's got an impressive resume just as the ones that he wrote and directed, but if you go back and look at

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[00:12:45] Phil: All right. Into the breakfast club. You said, Chris, did you, did you or did you not have all the beats you were not able to? I did not have all

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[00:12:55] Phil: for genre? I, I didn't actually write it down, but I want to [00:13:00] say probably a coming of age.

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[00:13:10] James: example of a rite, rite of passage

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[00:13:20] Chris: Yeah, so it says there's a problem, right?

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[00:13:27] Phil: to be a kid. No, it probably doesn't. So it says, I

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[00:13:51] Phil: they are.

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[00:14:09] Phil: So that's where these kids are. They're right on the brink, I think, of their They're in danger of their heart dying and becoming like their parents. I think a couple times throughout the movie, Are we going to be like our parents? It's inevitable. What? You know. And that

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[00:14:21] Chris: into what the principal was saying too about, Nah, these kids turned on me, man.

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[00:14:32] Phil: uh, Brian at the end realizes That this has already started. He said in his essay, we were brainwashed. Uh, and so this is, this is I think where they are. Their heart is about to die and they are starting to come to the conclusion that they've been brainwashed into a certain way of thinking and that they will perpetuate that if they become like their parents.

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[00:15:14] Phil: And I think that Hughes is saying this is. where they are, that they are being held prisoner, uh, in a prison of another's making. So, uh, living under inhumane conditions imposed upon them by authority figures whose hearts have already died. So, so those [00:15:30] who are over them are what they are destined to become unless something happens.

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[00:15:39] Chris: I think you could also make an argument for, for the genre, um, for it to be, uh,

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[00:15:46] Chris: as well, because you've got, um, so it says, uh, every story in this category is about a group, right? So you got a group of kids. Family organization doesn't matter what the group is.

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[00:16:14] Phil: know, almost like, uh, I haven't seen it in a long time, but one flew over the cuckoo's nest is a.

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[00:16:23] Chris: right at the beginning. He says, that's, that's my family, Kate. That's not me. And by the end he's, he's joined up. Cause I guess, and that brings us to the [00:16:30] third one. Finally, a sacrifice must be made and you get three endings.

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[00:16:36] Phil: into the, yeah. Because Brian had thought about, yeah. I don't know. Committing suicide and, uh, anyway. So they look, uh, the authorities, the, the ones who's already died. They look at these kids. Yeah. Uh, they see them at the choice of the, I didn't know that this song was written for this movie.

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[00:17:13] Phil: They are trying to institutionalize probably where a lot

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[00:17:22] Phil: big stars at the time. They, they would eventually become the Brat Pack, but I don't think they were that, you know,

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[00:17:28] Chris: Yeah. So, [00:17:30] and yeah, I just, I thought about, yeah, cause a million seems high to me for, but

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[00:17:48] Phil: Uh, and so this is the most important moment of their life, which is what you want to write a story about. You don't want to write a story about their everyday life. You want to write a story about the most important day in their life. And I think this is it. [00:18:00] Um, okay. So now we're into the opening image.

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[00:18:23] Phil: So you see them being dropped off by their parents. And there's not a single good situation there. They're all [00:18:30] being, you know, uh, thwarted by the various circumstances of each of their individual lives.

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[00:18:42] James: Right. And then you've got Oh, what's the nerd's name? Brian. Brian. Academics. Yeah, Brian's, you know, use every opportunity to study. I don't care what you do. Study, study, study. Yeah, we're

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[00:18:57] Chris: then, uh, Andrew's dad is like, uh, you [00:19:00] know, like, well, he just got caught.

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[00:19:08] Chris: you don't see his parents and he just, he walks straight up. And I think we had talked about this maybe last time is the. Uh, I don't remember the girl, Allie Sheedy, I don't remember the character's name, it slipped my mind, but she, her parents, whatever, have to slam on the brakes to avoid hitting Bender, and I think we talked about, like, from moment one, you see him, he's here to shake things up and be different, everyone else is being dropped off in this kind of mundane, depressive [00:19:30] way, and here he is just walking through, zero, you know, fucks given about what's

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[00:19:35] Phil: Well, her, her situation is, she says, my parents, they ignore me, and they just drop her off, and she goes to look at them, and they take off, Yeah. And then run straight into the one they cannot ignore. And I think we had talked about Bender will be this agent of change, the one that nobody, and he, and, uh, I don't know if I even thought of this last time, but he will say to Claire, you couldn't ignore me if you tried when they're having their [00:20:00] talk, you know, he's trying to get her go to whatever.

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[00:20:05] Chris: Those are, yeah, them being dropped off as the opening image. Yes,

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[00:20:19] Chris: Oh, and you'd made a note last time. Um, uh, you'd said it that, uh, on the epigraph, like it, um, it doesn't just fade

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[00:20:43] Phil: The things have to break down for the change that needs to happen to come. Uh, there's, they're going to have to shatter. And I think, I think they spend the rest of the movie doing that anyway. So I think we got the opening image, but I, I, the theme, [00:21:00] I don't know that I ever heard it clearly stated I have that it's hammered throughout, but well stated late and clearly by Allison.

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[00:21:24] Chris: change my I think it's an institutionalized.

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[00:21:38] Phil: Right. Yeah. Yes. Which one

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[00:21:41] James: Right. Right. Right. So that's kinda on the nose I would think.

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[00:21:51] Phil: mean, um. Heh heh. Yes. I have the arrival of the kids. The evidence of their brainwashing. Uh, Allison.

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[00:22:26] Phil: And that's what they're being defined with and that's how they're defining each other at this [00:22:30] point. And then of course we talked about Bender across the path of these jailers passes one, they cannot ignore who will bring their consultations to a screeching halt symbolically, but literally with the car, uh, Bender arriving, Alison's parents having to see him, the car coming to a stop.

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[00:22:55] James: touching

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[00:23:15] Phil: He makes Brian move Yeah, he's a bully bullies do that to the weaker and Brian is obviously the weaker, right? Brian is the brain Brain Brian. We talked about that. Okay. I think he's the saying, all these kids are gonna have to change their minds. So he moves the brain from one [00:23:30] side to the other. And I, so I think that's, I think, and that's what I'm talking about.

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[00:23:58] Phil: And he had a choice. He could [00:24:00] have moved any one of those kids. He could have had Bender sit down, whatever. No, he had to move. And I think he's because it's all about the changing of your mindset. And I, I just, I saw that and I thought. Well, that's it. That's what you know, and

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[00:24:19] Chris: And I think I think it all really kind of just if I think about some of the stories written together, right? Like it just boils down to like how in tune you are with the theme Yes Where a lot of it just comes out [00:24:30] naturally right because we were the themes in the back of our minds for thing Oh, we could do this because that pushes our theme, right?

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[00:24:42] Phil: you're really in tune, but it occurs naturally. If you are, yeah. And so like for any future, like, so, so as I watched this and as I thought about it, to me, like the number one thing.

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[00:25:16] Phil: He wouldn't do this, you know? So I think theme increasingly is the. Center about around which you should build a story, you know,

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[00:25:31] James: is obviously watching one of the masters, John Hughes do it.

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[00:25:38] Phil: yeah, it opened my

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[00:25:43] Phil: love note, John Hughes. And when I flipped it over and I saw James eyes get real big, I was like, Oh, Yeah, this is not working. Not good. We, we stopped him

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[00:25:53] James: How I love thee.

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[00:26:06] James: That's Philip about right. Bender

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[00:26:14] Phil: it a little bit later?

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[00:26:31] Phil: Right. So there's many pages. Oh, very nice. Yeah. Anything about that. Yeah. You see what I'm saying? Yeah. Yeah. Very nice. Uh, Hughes man, they're on their own page and by the end they're on the one. Yeah. Very nice. At the end, they're all on the same page. Nice. You see, I got, like, I started watching this and this is why I wanted a six hour podcast.

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[00:26:52] Chris: this movie was,

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[00:26:55] James: John Hughes out there haunting anybody that ever talks bad about his movies.

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[00:26:59] Phil: god, this, [00:27:00] I, I think like if, like if you could only select one, one John Hughes movie. I, I love Sixteen Candles, I love all his movies. I love Planes, Trains, Planes, Trains makes me cry every time. I love weird, I love them all. I like me, my wife likes me. Oh my god. Yeah, I like that one. Uh. Until James ruined it

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[00:27:17] Chris: Uh huh.

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[00:27:33] James: the money's

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[00:27:35] Chris: Yeah, no, going into this, like, Ferris Bueller, hands down. I love plane trains and automobiles too, but Ferris Bueller.

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[00:27:51] James: realized. Right. Maybe for the holiday movies, uh.

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[00:27:54] Phil: Yeah. Yeah. That way I'm telling you, man,

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[00:28:01] Phil: I don't, I don't

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[00:28:07] Sherry: don't know. It's two is my favorite.

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[00:28:22] Phil: He's saying something here beyond the mere words, this odd phrasing, maybe from, uh, the principal. This is some principal, whatever his name [00:28:30] is, uh, Vernon, right? Vernon. Yes. Maybe you will decide if you want to return and that's it. That's the state. You know, you, maybe you will decide if you want to return.

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[00:28:56] Phil: You need to decide if you want to return to the system or [00:29:00] whatever. And I think at the end they decide they do not but he could have said this a more natural way. And I think that's I think he's asking us in the audience. And these kids, if you look at it a little deeper, do you want to, you want to be in the group or do you want to be out?

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[00:29:18] Chris: this before last time, if I remember right. Um, yeah, they're, they're all kind of like Neo's that are aware that there's something slightly off their world and then Bender

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[00:29:29] Chris: about that. [00:29:30] Yeah, I think you mentioned

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[00:29:31] Phil: Yeah. Only Bender as the rebel leader challenges. His skills at this point are rage and sarcasm, but I think that will be enough to get them motivated. Bender himself struggles. He's full of rage. He's not the perfect leader and he doesn't have the perfect plan, but he knows something is wrong and he's the one that's going to lead the charge.

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[00:30:12] Phil: So Bender sees what others do not. I don't know that Bender on, you don't want to give too much credit to the character. Okay. This is the writer speaking through the character. So Bender may or may not be aware. Of everything that he's doing as a character, but as a character, he is the one, [00:30:30] uh, that is playing that role.

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[00:30:44] James: that his, his weapons or sarcasm and rage, I think rage. Uh, I didn't realize this until the second time after watching it after your love fest was Bender was, he's like, Hey, I've seen you around [00:31:00] before he was, you know, he was a butthead, but he didn't become nasty until Emilio Estevez turned around and jabbed at him.

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[00:31:12] Phil: by someone who probably sounds a lot like his own dad. Nobody wants you and they wouldn't have you. And this kind of thing. So he immediately sets him into his rage mode, right? And

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[00:31:27] James: Emilio Estevez turns around and he

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[00:31:41] Phil: I didn't think about that.

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[00:31:44] Chris: and was like, yeah. There's going to be two hits, me hitting

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[00:31:54] Phil: So he's been subject to all of that. Uh, and so that is what he's fighting against. And, and [00:32:00] yeah, that's an excellent point. I hadn't thought about that. Yeah. That's

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[00:32:10] Phil: he was the

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[00:32:14] Chris: He's the first one that talks about physical, you

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[00:32:28] Chris: So where is,

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[00:32:32] Phil: Okay, still set up. Okay. Uh, Bender gives the enemy a name. He calls him a brownie hound. Dealing with the currency of favor and basically ass kissing. That's how you get ahead in this world. Later when, uh, Vernon is down in the basement looking at files, getting dirt on other people. Oh, what, you know, uh, and the janitor comes in.

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[00:33:09] Phil: This is brownie hounds, right? And that's, so Bender identifies the enemy. Yeah. With

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[00:33:27] James: Again. Yes. A lot of sympathy for that

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[00:33:43] Chris: anything else. Okay. Um, like I guess I felt like maybe him removing the screw from the door.

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[00:33:48] Phil: door, like that was the catalyst. Yeah, I, I, I have that as Is that what you have? Yes. Okay, cool. Bender, he, cause he actually says the words, he wants to get this party started. Oh, nice. Okay. I missed that. Uh, and it's also the doorways that you [00:34:00] like so much. Yes. I, uh,

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[00:34:04] James: Yes.

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[00:34:16] James: system and screws fall out all the time, man.

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[00:34:19] James: so this is. Sorry to cut you off. No, no. When he says screws fall out all the time.

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[00:34:28] Phil: all the time. You know, I feel like he was definitely

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[00:34:34] Phil: to you, man. Yeah, this whole conversation is absolutely And, and it's awesome.

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[00:34:56] James: or sometimes screws just fall out, man.

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[00:35:03] Phil: So in any, in any societal change, there has been a screw that has fallen out. Right. Okay. Got a screw loose, uh, she go where, go there or whatever. I'm not, I'm not a big socialist or whatever, but he's held up. Is this rebel, uh, you know, Martin Luther King is the screw that fell out.

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[00:35:40] Phil: You know, Andrew and fixing the door and everything, Andrew, as archetypes, the archetypal always try to solve the problem according to their archetypal powers. And Andrew is physical. So it's always going to be a physical solution. He wants to fight. Claire always thinks she can buy her way out of it.

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[00:36:16] Chris: physically try to prop the door open with a couple things and it doesn't

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[00:36:19] Phil: Yes, yeah, absolutely. And then, and the system will always try to protect itself. Vernon ridicules Andrew. Yep. For the thing he told him to do. Right. Yeah. It was his idea,

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[00:36:30] Phil: idea. And that's, that's the brownie. How I can't look bad.

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[00:36:36] James: one. Brian's like, but aren't there

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[00:36:57] Phil: I think the stakes here are [00:37:00] reiterated, and we can talk about this as we go, because Bender's greatest fear is that his life now will be his life forever, and Vernon says to him after this whole scene about getting all the detentions, uh, I'm gonna have you for the rest of your natural born life, and that's the first time, one of maybe one or two times that he actually shows fear.

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[00:37:32] James: his

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[00:37:37] Phil: I think it's this door slamming in the, in the hole. All right. So, uh, I don't, we're still not in the break into two as I have it. We're coming up on it and I'll, I'll get to it. And then you could sort of tell me what yours was. Allison, we already have a reference to the, well, we will have a reference to the bridge over the river cry with the, with the whistling, but Allison is drawing a [00:38:00] bridge.

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[00:38:16] Phil: So I think. Hughes is subtly reminding us this is a journey and they're crossing over from one place to another, maybe a little reading into it, but why a picture of a bridge? Right. She could've been drawing anything, anything.

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[00:38:29] Phil: something. So [00:38:30] yeah, it's a bridge, a bridge. I just, and then the, the, the song, which I think didn't, didn't.

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[00:38:53] Phil: Bender is destroying a book. The book is by Mollier. Mollier wrote political comedies back in the day and is considered one of the [00:39:00] greatest writers of comedies ever. Uh, but every one of, a lot of his comedies held up a social issue to get people to look at it. Right. And that's the book that Bender is occupied with.

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[00:39:27] Phil: And then Bender looks at it when the others say, [00:39:30] Oh yeah, I like his work or whatever, you know, uh, absolute choices every step of the way. You know, and

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[00:39:37] Phil: books. Yes. Well, the, the

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[00:39:46] James: Have you actually read it? That's what I was thinking. Yeah, they're just all bullshitting each other. They're not being real.

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[00:40:03] Phil: What about Bender? Do you think he actually No, Bender looks at it like, huh? Yeah, right. Cause he's kind of amazed when they say Cause I'm sure when he heard Moliere, he was like, Oh, you know, brainy, nerdy stuff, blah, blah, blah book. Yeah, right. And he, he kind of looks at it, he looks at it almost the same way as when Claire says to Brian that it's okay for a guy to be a virgin.

[: 00:40:23

[00:40:43] Phil: No, that is completely unique to this movie. And what does that mean, trapped in a vacancy, uh, because it's such an odd phrase to me, to my ear, it sounded completely odd. Nothing you can do when you're trapped in a vacancy. Bender is saying we are, we are trapped in a, in a big void of nothing that seems [00:41:00] like it's something, you know, but it's really nothing.

[: 00:41:02

[00:41:31] Phil: You know, the appearance of Carl, the janitor seen as the untouchable peasant, a peon, his convenient definition is that untouchable peasant peon janitor. What, what does one have to do to become a janitor, janitor associated with, and he says, you know, untouchable peasant peon. So they. They are on the brink of being brainwashed and really almost already have, seeing each other in these roles and then seeing the janitor and having this attitude.

[: 00:41:55

[00:41:56] James: what was his name? Uh, he was in the beginning [00:42:00] credits, he's the man of the year, you know, decade before or so. So he just, he's in this life. He's comfortable in this life. He's still at the school.

[: 00:42:09

[00:42:17] Phil: So suddenly. That, that several viewings you might start to pick up on this because he does have his picture of man of the year and now he's a janitor. Oh, you think, oh, he's fallen. Oh my God. What happened to this poor guy? Right? But he doesn't see it that way. I'm the [00:42:30] eyes and ears of this place. I, you know, I go in, so he, he seems, he's thriving in that system.

[: 00:42:34

[00:42:55] Phil: So we want to see a janitor and think, Oh, this poor guy, you know, he doesn't see it that [00:43:00] way. He is defying his own simple. Uh, definition, he knows what time it is. He looks at the clock and he can, and he sees a clock is fast or slow. I can't remember which, but he knows what time it is. That's the first thought that occurred to me.

[: 00:43:13

[00:43:33] Phil: Uh, because I think they unify around Bender, even though they're separate, they don't rat him out anyway, by the end of the first act, they're whistling this song together, uh, all together. And I'm seeing that as the act break. Uh, they start whistling. Yes. Okay. They have answered the call and are ready for act two.

[: 00:43:50

[00:43:54] Chris: it. Um, I, I, I didn't know if them when they decide to sneak out in the [00:44:00] library, you know, if that was, it seemed like that was maybe too late,

[: 00:44:03

[00:44:08] Phil: Yeah, there's a, there's a, I think it might be like the beginning of act two or whatever, but yeah, they, uh, up to that point they were at each other. Um, it's the first time they do anything together and they were separate. Yeah,

[: 00:44:20

[00:44:21] Phil: I think, yeah, they're not there yet, but this is something they weren't doing at the beginning.

[: 00:44:26

[00:44:48] Phil: Okay. When they're having their various conversations, uh, Alison and Andrew on the way to get drinks or whatever, uh, Claire Bender and Brian. Talking about being a virgin, not being a virgin, they, they [00:45:00] start calling each other by first names. Hughes does several things by showing us unlike things put together, right?

[: 00:45:07

[00:45:24] James: Sugar, deliciousness. Yes. Captain Crunch.

[: 00:45:26

[00:45:29] Phil: One [00:45:30] only, only one has a bandana. So there's all these things of mismatched items that I think. Is what Hughes is saying, I'm, I'm going to mix these kids up and what appears may not seem normal to them, but it's going to be what has to happen. Being a virgin is okay. Then being confronted with Andrew, why, why are you really here?

[: 00:45:51

[00:46:09] Phil: Vernon is making his own sandwich, sitting under a rigid character, a rigid, uh, calendar. For a rigid products right over his head. It says rigid vendor is bender. The one who will bend things, whatever. Part of

[: 00:46:22

[00:46:27] Phil: Yeah, probably about 20 minutes short.

[: 00:46:29

[00:46:30] James: sitting under a rigid

[: 00:46:31

[00:46:45] Phil: Resisting convenient definitions, uh, feels good. Their heart not dying feels good. The brain a little less washed feels good. Okay. He's saying being bad feels good, but he's saying this is. This is defying your roles and it's pretty good, huh? And it [00:47:00] does. All right. So now there's a song that is playing when they're running away.

[: 00:47:04

[00:47:19] Phil: It's in the credits, but standout lines. Uh, because that's what he did with, with don't you forget about me in the beginning. I think those lines of that song are spot [00:47:30] on as to what is happening with these kids. I think this song stands out for what is, what Bender is doing. There are two standout lines to me.

[: 00:47:38

[00:47:58] Phil: The song is talking about a crossroads, obviously, [00:48:00] right? Right. Are you going to be, uh, the everyday boy? Are you going to be the old way boy? Uh, or are you going to run and fight the grip of the power game? And that's the movie. That's the exact, you know, a choice is made and that's the movie. Now, they are running.

[: 00:48:15

[00:48:38] Phil: Uh, and I, another choice. I think that is exactly right. You're going to, if you're going to fall into the old ways. You're going to run right back up into your bars. Bender, then Claire says, okay, now, you know, we're all caught. We're done. And he says, no, only me. And again, he's playing the archetypal role of the savior.

[: 00:48:55

[00:49:35] Chris: so is that like a, is that what you have?

[: 00:49:36

[00:49:48] Phil: what you had. Okay. There are, Bender's caught and he's put in isolation or whatever and this is the second time that I think.

[: 00:49:55

[00:49:55] Chris: in the gym shooting the basketball because he's working, he's going to

[: 00:49:57

[00:50:08] Phil: Bender and taking his shoes off and had that other

[: 00:50:10

[00:50:13] Chris: had, you know, athlete shoes

[: 00:50:15

[00:50:26] Phil: And then in isolation, when you forgotten all about this place. Uh, [00:50:30] I'll be there and I'm going to kick the living shit out of you. And Bender shows fear at that point. Because that, I think, is his greatest fear. I will never be free of this. Uh, never be free of this system.

[: 00:50:40

[00:50:44] Phil: midpoint or no?

[: 00:50:45

[00:51:10] Phil: What, what are you talking about? Where'd you get these glasses? There's no set up for the glasses, right? Okay. He is going to change the way they see things. There's no other reason for these glasses to even be there for better hallway vision. It's a throwaway line. Okay. But why glasses? Why to Andrew? Why?

[: 00:51:26

[00:51:44] Phil: He's certainly not, uh, you wouldn't think of Bender and think of Christ. Okay. But one of the things, and, and, and I don't think he was meant for this to be a religious or spiritual movie, but I think he did mean it for. Uh, a story about a character who changes other characters and [00:52:00] to the degree that that is true, one of the, you know, verses about Jesus, he gave them, you have eyes to see, but you do not see.

[: 00:52:08

[00:52:26] Phil: But I, I, at that point, I'm, I wanted to build an altar, [00:52:30] you know, the man who leads the way. Okay. We just had that song giving them eyes to see cause I, cause I thought about these classes, like, where did he get them? What does he wear them? We never seen him wearing them. Yeah. So does it bother you that

[: 00:52:45

[00:52:46] Chris: Cause I mean, it's really cool. And I, and I agree with you, that's gotta be what he's saying. What Hughes is saying. Would it have been better if they were set up because it's almost you know, you can I don't know I say you can see the writer's hand, right? The glasses are there because it's because you need them to be there

[: 00:52:59

[00:53:00] Phil: And it's such a sarcastic throwaway line, you know

[: 00:53:02

[00:53:18] Chris: Uh, you're

[: 00:53:19

[00:53:31] Chris: Didn't refuse and to stay in the library.

[: 00:53:33

[00:53:36] Phil: but they still went the wrong way. Yes, because he's falling back into the old way that they haven't gotten to the point where they can view it the way he does. Yes.

[: 00:53:45

[00:53:56] James: So maybe that's in there, but [00:54:00] theatrical version. That's a question mark. That might be something, you know, you can put in your altar

[: 00:54:06

[00:54:18] Phil: He got my doobage. He has a tool that will tear down the last of their inhibitions, something that will remove the wash from their brains, literally, doobage. So, everybody gets high at this point. Except [00:54:30] Allison, and I'm not entirely certain why she doesn't. I don't know if I've ever nailed that down. Might mix with her lithium.

[: 00:54:35

[00:55:03] Phil: I think some of 'em, and, you know, and Yep. Mm-Hmm. , yeah. Yeah.

[: 00:55:06

[00:55:07] Phil: minute. Yes. And so I think. This is a, a midpoint false victory, but it's way late. It's not, there's only like 30 or four or 35 minutes left in the movie. Initially I had

[: 00:55:17

[00:55:21] Chris: So I thought, okay, well maybe him getting caught was a

[: 00:55:23

[00:55:27] Chris: got you for the net and the rest of your natural life just felt like bad guys [00:55:30] close into me. But then, then that would mean that the, the weed thing is a break in the three and that seems, that doesn't seem right.

[: 00:55:36

[00:55:37] Phil: there is cause, cause I think from the midpoint to act three. Is fairly condensed. Yeah. Bad guys close in. Vernon in the basement. We see the coin of this realm. The way things are done. Seeking advantage over people. And currying favor. Vernon buys himself some brownie points for 50 bucks.

[: 00:55:52

[00:56:13] Phil: Is it bad? Real bad? Yes. What do they do to you? So this conversation between Allison and Andrew, they are starting to see each other's prisons, right? At that point, all is lost, of course, has to be a false defeat. They fall back into their old ways, the politics of power, instead of being together, like at the [00:56:30] midpoint, uh, Bender has one more wall to dare to tear down.

[: 00:56:33

[00:56:54] Phil: I would never do that. Others are not so sure. Uh, Alison is saying it's inevitable. Your heart will [00:57:00] die. So there's, they're, they're, they're having a defeat here because the high is over, but they're, and, and, and, and they're coming down and they're starting to, okay, I see what's happening here, but are we going to be brave enough to make it a permanent change?

[: 00:57:14

[00:57:31] Phil: Claire's in tears. Alison is in tears. Everyone is at the lowest they're ever going to be in this movie. I think negative

[: 00:57:39

[00:57:41] Phil: the, the kid that he bullied or whatever. How do you take something like that back? You never can. Right. The humiliation. Yeah. Yes. Um, Claire says it's different for you.

[: 00:57:50

[00:58:06] Phil: So through all of that, then they laugh. Act three, at that point, is what I have.

[: 00:58:11

[00:58:25] Phil: stuff.

[: 00:58:25

[00:58:45] Phil: That's most likely. Vendor is not letting anybody in. Right. Allison, nobody's letting anybody in. Right? Uh, why are you being so nice to me? Because you're letting me. It's an odd phrase, but it's, that's, that's exactly what needs to happen. It's a two way street, right? Right. You have to [00:59:00] accept what you have to be accepted.

[: 00:59:01

[00:59:02] Chris: we were talking about the, the getting high thing and the dancing, uh, I think we'd mentioned it last time, I just remembered Andrew goes in there into that room and close the door and screams and shatters that door.

[: 00:59:11

[00:59:19] Phil: Maybe he thought it was a little too on the nose. Cause it does seem a little implausible, a little implausible that he would be at a. They

[: 00:59:28

[00:59:38] James: Yeah. It played

[: 00:59:39

[00:59:41] Chris: Um, and I was thinking about what you had said about Alison and why she doesn't get high, right? Yeah. So earlier in the movie, he says, I've seen you, right. And she's the one of all the people that draws the bridge. Yeah. So in a way, like she's kind of where, like, she's not, she doesn't need her inhibitors brought down as much as everybody else.

[: 00:59:57

[00:59:58] Phil: than she's aware. [01:00:00] She's almost more aware than Bender, but she didn't need the glasses or the courage at this point. Yeah. She needs Bender, you know? Yeah. The song that is playing here again, a choice. It's called, it's called, We Are Not Alone, uh, that they're dancing to and all this kind of thing.

[: 01:00:17

[01:00:35] Phil: Brian writes the essay. A manifesto of the New Rebellion is what I'm calling it, hereafter known as the Breakfast Club, or whatever. They accept each other, and the untouchable peon, the Carl, a peon, Carl the janitor, uh, the new order on display. As they're leaving, they all say bye to Carl. And Carl says bye to them.

[: 01:00:51

[01:01:12] Phil: I think he starts hanging out with Carl and help him clean up on detention. And I think at some point he becomes a janitor, but, but, um, the Mr. Miyagi of janitors, maybe, you know, I don't think he ever feels ashamed about being a janitor. Ever, you know, now maybe he doesn't, but I could see that if you were like fan fiction, I [01:01:30] would write, you know, Bender's story that way or whatever they accept each other.

[: 01:01:34

[01:01:35] Chris: good. I was gonna they exchange items of each other to back to I feel like back to that Mixing and matching thing you were talking about. Yes, cuz uh, cuz bender takes Claire's diamond earring I think he puts it in his own ear, right? Yes, and then Allison rips off his Andrews patch or whatever like so it's them

[: 01:01:53

[01:01:54] Phil: Yes. Absolutely, yeah. The jailers, the jailers pick them up again, but they will no longer be held captive [01:02:00] by them I said. Uh, Vernon reads the essay and knows that, I'm saying Vernon reads the essay and knows he is lost. Each, each one of us is a brain, an outcast, an athlete, a princess, and a criminal. Uh, we will not allow ourselves any longer to be brainwashed and defined by yours or anybody else's convenient definitions.

[: 01:02:16

[01:02:32] Chris: Yeah. So if we go with the institutionalized, I mean, they,

[: 01:02:34

[01:02:35] Phil: They burned it down. Yeah. Uh, nice. Yeah. That fits really

[: 01:02:39

[01:02:40] Phil: I like that. Yeah. Now there's, there's, there's a lot going on in that movie nuances. That is, I think essentially it, but I would challenge anybody to watch this movie and just pay attention to every single thing that's going on. And, and if, if, if a, if a name like Moliere is mentioned, look it up because it's intentional.

[: 01:02:57

[01:02:57] James: When, uh, after last time [01:03:00] again, I went home and viewed it more as, and they're in purgatory, you know, they all arrived, they're going to decide if they're coming back here, if they're going on with their former life. And this movie is awesome. I never thought of that. Seeing it as a kid coming up. I never looked that far deep into it.

[: 01:03:16

[01:03:19] Phil: him. Right. No, I watched it a bunch of times before this time. And then I don't know what, uh, some, something triggered it. Maybe I looked up Moyer or something like that, I don't know, because I thought, well, I got to make notes about [01:03:30] this. Okay, well, why Moyer?

[: 01:03:31

[01:03:49] Phil: But this movie, like you could watch it and there's more going on than meets the eye. And I think, I think Hughes was Intentional about that. They

[: 01:03:57

[01:04:03] Phil: of stuff. Yeah. Talk about compact and efficient economical writing.

[: 01:04:07

[01:04:08] Chris: yeah, I think I'd mentioned it, I think before, like on our, on our group chat or whatever, that, uh, pitch perfect. With Anna Kendrick, like she's kind of the, the rebel of the, the group and I feel like she's, in hindsight, I feel like she's kind of the bender of, of that movie. Right. She even dresses in plaid and dresses in similar colors

[: 01:04:26

[01:04:27] Phil: Yeah, yeah, yeah. You sent me that picture and I was like, well, that's Bender's clothes, aren't they?

[: 01:04:29

[01:04:35] Phil: this movie. Okay. Well, that's intentional then. Yeah. Yeah.

[: 01:04:37

[01:04:41] Chris: Yeah. Yeah. And she's very closed off and all this stuff. And at one point, like she, she kind of shrugs it off or whatever. I remember right. It initially. Yeah. Um, and even like he, cause he's a big movie fan. He talks about Star Wars and she makes fun of that going. Vader literally means, you know, father, like, you know, he's like, how did you know that?

[: 01:04:57

[01:05:11] Chris: Yeah, I'd never even

[: 01:05:14

[01:05:18] Chris: Pitch Perfect? Oh, they're a lot of fun, man. I don't like musicals, but they're funny and they're, you know,

[: 01:05:24

[01:05:27] James: Thanks. I appreciate it.

[: 01:05:29

[01:05:38] Phil: that, you know. Well, uh, pass, consider, recommend, section, I obviously, my God, if Obviously it's pass.

[: 01:05:43

[01:05:48] James: Yeah, absolutely. I was probably on, in the middle of that last time. Yeah. And now I'm definitely Yeah, recommend hard.

[: 01:05:58

[01:06:23] Phil: The, the simple definitions today could be, you know, whatever your politics are, you know, [01:06:30] uh, how you identify, you know. Sure, yeah, no, yeah, I think Hughes works. Yeah, just swap out, put in civil rights, okay, that was good in the 60s, put in gender identification, whatever, that movie, the theme of that movie is timeless and I think he executes it in such a way that it would speak a hundred years from now to whatever thing is happening, you know, whatever, anyway.

[: 01:06:53

[01:06:55] Sherry: really want to know? You really want to know what I

[: 01:06:58

[01:07:01] Phil: She doesn't go as deep as I do.

[: 01:07:02

[01:07:18] Phil: were at the time.

[: 01:07:19

[01:07:21] Sherry: Yeah. I didn't see it in the theater. I didn't see it. Saw it later. Couldn't relate to it because you know, the way I looked at it was [01:07:30] okay. Yeah. It's entertaining. I couldn't relate to any of them as far as me in high school, I was in the band. So I'm, I'm the band nerd that was not represented, represented.

[: 01:07:43

[01:08:04] James: I think you had said something about, you were real mad about when they were messing up the cards and ripping books.

[: 01:08:08

[01:08:11] James: Decimal cards. He was Flippin and movin them around and

[: 01:08:14

[01:08:17] Phil: I think You don't do that. No, I don't, I don't think I identify specifically with a single one. But, like, if you had to press me, I would probably be a cross between maybe, uh, Brian and Allison.

[: 01:08:27

[01:08:51] James: you know It's like one person split into five fractions You're a little bit of all

[: 01:08:56

[01:09:01] Sherry: and I guess I'm just wrong for not think I don't know.

[: 01:09:05

[01:09:15] Phil: But that's the beauty of it. That it can be enjoyed on almost any level.

[: 01:09:17

[01:09:24] Sherry: Oh, absolutely. And I mean, as far as, and as. Talking about work. I [01:09:30] discussed this last time that the books are in this room. It was actually a gymnasium. They turned into a library. Correct? Yes.

[: 01:09:38

[01:09:42] Sherry: were donated, they were going to be recycled, but they were actually put in the correct order. So they, they did take the time even

[: 01:09:51

[01:09:52] Phil: The set designer put it in the Dewey Decimal System, which you will never see. Yeah, that's cool. Yeah. Anyway, so would you pass recommend or [01:10:00] consider? Oh,

[: 01:10:00

[01:10:26] Phil: they're

[: 01:10:27

[01:10:28] Sherry: This is, this is, [01:10:30] it gets kind

[: 01:10:30

[01:10:49] Phil: Uh, you know, whatever, but yeah, it gets dark. It does. Well, I mean, but never gets as dark as this. I don't think Ferris Bueller gets as dark as this,

[: 01:10:56

[01:11:10] Sherry: From the, like I was in the honor classes to the ones who weren't, I mean, we were all one as a band. So, okay. I guess I can see that

[: 01:11:22

[01:11:26] Sherry: I am a band nerd

[: 01:11:27

[01:11:38] Chris: And there's the one they identify with is Vernon, like the, the end of the movie. They go, holy shit, I'm burning . Well, you know, and then they have some sort of like, life, you know,

[: 01:11:45

[01:11:55] Phil: We may not be aware of how we simply define people, you know, [01:12:00] how, you know, so you're saying, you know, okay, well, I don't, I just can't identify with any of them and, and I'm not saying that, you know, that you simply define people, but they're, but looking back, I mean, there may be ways that. You did conveniently define and were never brought to your attention or she's just on a higher plane.

[: 01:12:17

[01:12:18] Phil: play apply labels to people. Phil. Yeah. No,

[: 01:12:21

[01:12:26] Phil: need therapy. No, absolutely. That's 100 percent true. And I [01:12:30] think they get it. I mean, absolutely.

[: 01:12:32

[01:12:43] James: It's

[: 01:12:43

[01:12:59] Phil: Yeah. And so [01:13:00] there was this tendency as they were caught up in trying to get careers and money to just ignore you or only pay attention to what you were doing When it started to hit the radar, like, oh my God, your grades are down. Oh my God, you, you know, you, you're gonna lose your scholarship because they were so preoccupied.

[: 01:13:14

[01:13:30] Chris: I didn't hear your recommendation. Oh, yeah, it's

[: 01:13:32

[01:13:36] Phil: Alright, we're out then. To me, like, the number one thing a writer should do first is, is decide what he wants to say.

[: 01:13:46

[01:13:47] Phil: Everyone else is being dropped off. Run straight into the one they cannot ignore. Because when you grow up, your heart dies. That's, I think that's the premise of this movie.

[: 01:13:56

[01:14:13] Phil: I've seen you, you know.

[: 01:14:15

[01:14:16] Phil: man. At that point I'm like, oh my gosh, that's, that's, uh, it's gotta be. There's many pages. Oh, very nice. Yeah, see what I'm saying? Yeah, very nice. Huge, man. They're all on their own page and by the end they're on the one. Yeah, very nice. And at the end they're all on the [01:14:30] same page.